Lord's Prayer and the existence of alcoholic Jews

Yup, I'll admit it.  Sober Recovery forums inspired this topic.  Forgive me if you will.

My take?  It's a Christian prayer.  If it's in the group conscience to say it at the end of the meeting, who are you to bitch about it?  If you don't like the prayer, shut the bleep up, vote with your feet, and go form your anti-Christ meeting someplace else.

Instead of getting into the A.A. traditions and the violations of demonstrating some Christianity in an A.A. meeting, let's consider the spirit of the deal, shall we?  I don't think it's so much about cramming Christianity up anybody's ass as it's utilizing a wonderful prayer to close up a meeting.  Listen to the words in the prayer and see what they mean to you.  Do not the tennants of the prayer transcend any "brand" of religion and cite spiritual ideals that we can all put to use and practice? 

Our Father, which art in heaven.  Hallowed be thy name.
Thy kingdom come.  Thy will be done, in earth as it is in heaven.
Give us this day our daily bread.  And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive them that trespass against us. 
And lead us not into temptation; but deliver us from evil;
For thine is the kingdom, the power, and the glory, for ever and ever.

Amen.

I love this prayer and this prayer is why I believe that Jesus and Christianity kicks the dog-fuck out of all other religions.  An eye for an eye?  Really?  Strap bombs to yourself?  Wow.  Not to say the United States of America is acting so Christian when they/we meddle in Middle East affairs... if someone smites you, give them our left cheek as well, and if someone persecutes you to go a mile, go with him twine and all that shit.  Sounds to me like the US of A goes Old Testament once in a while.

I have an A.A. book that says we are to "see where religious people are right and to make use of what they offer."  Not to piss and moan about it being the wrong brand and that if I say a Christian prayer, I'll get Jesus Cooties and be damned to Eternal Damnation.

The prayer has some good stuff in it and if you don't like it, I encourage you to ask yourself why.  It perfectly states many of the paradoxes of life and a path to the spiritual life which the A.A. program is all about. 

If you're an atheist or an anti-Christ, I say you should try something besides A.A. anyway, because you'll never make it past the 2nd Step if you don't change your mind and waste the time and thankless love poured onto you from a potential sponsor.

Are you a fucking Alcoholic or are you a fucking Atheist or are you a fucking Jew?  Make up your mind.  If you're a Jew, wonderful!  Why do you drink too much?  Missing something?  Maybe your faith can save you.  Why go to A.A.?  Tell the courts it's against your religion and find an alternative.

Now... to the Jew-Alcoholic thing.  I personally have seen a Jew in A.A. before.  He was from Denver and his name was Gene.  He was a crazy fuck.  A loveable and crazy smart pious fuck!  He was also a recovered alcoholic.  He one time helped me to experience Jesus Christ when I was in the spiritual desert.  Figure that one out.

I believe the tennants of "Under the Influence by James Robert Milam and Katherine Ketcham.  They say that Italians and Jews are alcoholic, but minimally... as in down to the baseline 10%, whereas other cultures have it more prevalently... like the Native American and American Eskimos.  The premise is that the former have been around alcohol many thousands of years, like maybe 7500+ years, whereas, the latter has been around the strong distilled liquor some few or several hundred years, so their alcoholics have not died off yet... to get to that baseline of 10%

If you don't believe that, great. You and I disagree.

If you forgo a meeting because they say the Lord's Prayer, I say too bad.  I knew a guy who was Christian and had a hard time with the prayer because people fucked it up.  They said it wrong, so he never recited the prayer.  He meditated during the prayer instead. 

He was right about them saying it wrong.  I react differently.  I say the prayer rightly as y'all say it wrong, but I don't make a big fucking deal about it.

Selfish self-centered egocentric fucks.




          

The Lord's Prayer

They're discussing this "topic" over at SR and I finally decided to delve into it... aka read it, and it... the thread... met my expectations.

It was all I thought it could be.

Someone introducing an opinion on the tradition/custom of closing an A.A. meeting with the Lord's Prayer.  Edit: I'd go so far as to say it appears they are merely asking questions about it and others have opinions about it... but the whole topic is controversial in nature.  Is the whole custom not a violation of one of the 12 traditions?  Technically, yeah, possibly... if taken out of context.  So, it's a Christian prayer.  Big deal.  BFD.  Are Christian prayers a crime?  No.  Does the book not say "Be quick to see where religious people are right?  Make use of what they offer?"  Yes.  They're offering something and some like to whine and bitch.  That's what this is about.  You're not a Christian?  Fine.  I don't really give a fuck.  Do you?  Really?  I like to fart when I'm up a tree.  Do you care about that too?

BP added a piece that caught my eye.  This is sort of what I would have said... if given the chance;

Fox's chapter on The Lord's Prayer allows me to see and experience the prayer on a deeper level. Since then I have not been able to say the prayer at the end of the meeting without real concentration and contemplation on every word. By the way it ends with AMEN, not "keep coming back, it works if you work it". A greater consideration would be this.....instead of why do we use the Lord's Prayer, why do we defile such a prayer with some treatment center chant like " Keep Coming Back....blah blah blah".

Yeah!  Read the damned Fox's breakdown of it and at least see what you think.  If that doesn't have you really absorbing every word, then turn it loose and take two steps back and don't join the damned circle when they do the prayer.  Who gives a shit?

It's really about you, isn't it... Ananda?  I don't give a shit if you like the prayer or not.  Start an Athiests are Us meeting if you'd like.  Whistle Dixie through your left nostril during the prayer.  Fart the National Anthem if you'd like.  But get off of yourself.  And if you're gonna a take the trouble to go (sorry for spelling), whip out a new tab and google Group Conscience for Christ's Sake!

And BP!  No shit!  I hate the chanting at the end; "It works if you work it!"  So some of us added "...and it sucks if you don't, because you're worth it!"  Chanting sucks and is for losers.  You might as well say, "We don't need no whiskey sours, we got us a Higher Powerz!"

Oh yeah.  Lord's Prayer.  If you don't like it, form a group that doesn't use it and shut the fuck up about it.  Or start a wetoded thread about it.

Have a nice day.