Wednesday, June 13, 2012

Willful vs Willing

What do you think of that for a topic?

The caveat is, you have to describe it as it applies to you now... not someone else nor a "less sober" you.

Anybody want to discuss?


  1. Nice topic,food for thought. I am willing to pray and meditate daily, I'm sure I am willful as well but I'm not overly worried about it, I like how I feel inside and outside.

    The book talks about the proper use of the will, alligning our free will with what God would have us be. Still trying to find the balance between taking the book instructions to the extreme and just doing whatever I feel like. Interested in hearing what other's experience is on this.

  2. My first thought is the term "contradistinction"

    Willfulness is anytime there is an exertion of "self" in contradistinction to the will of God.

    transitive verb
    : to distinguish by contrasting qualities

  3. My insides felt so shitty the other morning that they became my outsides. I don't know if I had the 24 hour flu or a good case of food poisoning. I honestly didn't know whether to sit down on the toilet or whether to kneel down before it.

    Sober puking is the worst. In my sickness... while sleeping... after having taken a sick day from work... the radiator shop told me my radiator was done. So I had to decide... am I going to try to drive across town to get this thing?

    It made me think of what I've heard in meetings... will power is driving in traffic with diarrhea. I guess you could say I was willful. Well I got the part home and was able to slap it back together today.

    Willing is what comes upon me after surrender I guess. Nightly review, on awakening... so much more willing to surrender with my face in the toilet. But to pray and meditate in good times... that's nice too.

  4. I think that maybe willful may be the same thing as "Willpower".

    What is the will? It is our resources. Remember? "...resources as marshalled by the will...?

    My will is the best of me. It's what I believe to be right and wrong.

    The book talks on pages 22 and 23 about our attempts to attack our drinking problems head-on.. by our will power... by our own resources.

    Many anti/XAers are out there saying, "You are NOT powerless. You have power." Well great. If you have power, have a nice day see ya later.

    Now back on page 12, becoming "willing" to look to God's Grace* to remove the obsession to drink is considered. Of course this Grace*... for some of us... can be our inner being in some form or another... for those of you who are/were agnostic/atheist/etc.

    But for those of us who are not fettered by such obstacles, we may put it as being our willingness to seek and exercise our God-consciousness.

    Now, to do steps, does this mean we need willingness and no willpower? Methinks not. How about our need to exert a little willpower Sunday or Saturday morning when we get a 12 step call? To do steps 4, 5, 9, 10 and 11?

    Will power is maybe not all bad, huh? The book talks about the "proper use of the will".

    What is "proper use of the will" to you?

    1. Willpower/power over alcohol?
      I have no power over alcohol, and never did. That is what makes me an alcoholic.
      I have been reading "John Barleycorn" by Jack London (1913), and think all here would enjoy it and learn from it as well as I am. It is free in e-book format, btw.
      Jack wrote of alcoholism from first-hand experience, and died from it just three years after this book was published.
      Don't let the 99 year ago publishing date discourage you; John Barleycorn doesn't look a day over 21, and never will!

  5. Question; is all self-will necessarily self-will run riot... and evil?