Monday, May 30, 2011


Come across any of these lately?  I see some folks who are having a hard time staying sober on MOTR... so I think.  They seem to know where the good meetings are, but the more they relapse and drink, the more I see them coming back to the weak MOTR "let us love you till you kill yourself" meetings.

They know damn-well there are folks who would welcome them back, but they don't want to face the music?  They don't want to do steps?  They don't want to succeed?

I went to a MOTR meeting the other day and the most passionate share was a guy struggling with quitting tobacco chewing... Copenhagen no less.  This is not the worst topic I've heard from this group.  For example, just in this meeting, they made their 20 minute round of announcements, introductions, chips, birthdays, etc... then the chair person said, "Does anyone have a topic?"  Then under my breath... I said... like I always do... "CHAIR THE FUCKING MEETING, BITCH!"  So... the bleeding deacon of the meeting... a guy with 3 years in this case, says, "Well since we have a new person, let's make Step 1 the topic.  So that they did... until she called on people to share.... and three folks passed. 

I got called on.  I talked about insanity... as it applies to the person who is sober... the moment prior to drinking.  I talked about my experience with it and where I am now with sanity... and how the doing of the steps moved me away from insanity.

Well, after the meeting, I went to the guy struggling with the copenhagen and I told him I've been off of tobacco, specifically Copenhagen... for something like 4 years now.  He told me he did that, had quit for a year, and he would not/can not stop now.  He's basically a "will-not" with tobacco.  That's fine.

But why come to an A.A. meeting and fucking bitch about it?  It's like these guys who come dragging into A.A., but always find a reason to not finish their 4th steps or want to write another 4th step instead of finishing amends.  I don't get it.  Do you want to fail?  If so, why come to A.A.?


  1. Don't want to take up your time, however, my NA sponsor got me clean on the Big Book, not the Basic Text. After 4 years of being told we weren't welcome in AA she started NA in our area. We didn't have the NA book then so we used the AA book and improvised. Almost everyone who came got clean until we started to get the recovery house, treatment, court ordered types. The ones from AA that smoked pot in parking lots of AA meetings started to come but wouldn't give up their sobriety dates for clean dates so they left and stayed loaded in AA.(GOOD RIDDANCE) Now I'm an outsider in the NA community, (a position I relish) and not welcome in the real AA meetings because, duh, I'm an addict. I go to NA, and look for other addicts who got clean on the AA principles. Thanks for this blog and I'll try not to offend you with my status but it's interesting that we share the same types of problems. Been clean since 12/5/82.

  2. Awesome!  You are welcome and congrats.

    I'm an alcoholic but I don't poke smot. Why?  Because it would screw with my spirituality and I'd go back to drinking and that would be that.  But could I smoke a doobie and not change my sobriety date?  Sure.  I'd have to because I'd lie by omission about getting stoned.  I don't understand how some in A.A. could knowingly do drugs and not come clean.

    I know a guy who was in our little group in Pueblo and left to join the big bad Denver group, got successful, got married, got a house, and got a drug habit.  Last time I saw him at a retreat and he dogged me for gaining a few pounds and having too much time on my hands for being jobless.  Meanwhile, he was stealing pills from his sick dad.

    Fucking asshole. He's back in the group and "sober". He did not change his wonderful 10+ year sobriety date. He's not made amends to me either. Does he owe me an amend? Yes, for being a lying hypocritical POS and for snubbing me.

    But guess what? He can keep his amend and his sobriety. I want neither and I'm glad I'm not him. Hope his family life and home are warm.

    Welcome here and ... tell us what you think A.A. and N.A. should do to better accomodate those in recovery who are just addicts, just alkies, and/or both.

    PS, I still can't post here from my own computer. I had to type this from my damned cell phone.

  3. Thanks Barbara. Hearing the kind of stuff that you shared does my heart good. I wish something like that would happen in this town.

  4. I don't consider someone who keeps coming to meetings and have a hard time staying sober to be "relapsing". You have to get sober in order to relapse.

    Two or three weeks (or months) of not drinking isn't sobriety. These folks just keep going to the easy meetings to make themselves feel good. If they went to a decent meeting someone would call them on their shit and make them take a hard look at themselves. They'd rather hear "we'll love you 'til you can love yourself' and "keep coming back" and all that bullshit.

    Now, as to your rant about chairing meetings, Patrick. Different meetings do it differently. I go to discussion meetings where the chair picks the topic and people share as they want to. Other meetings the topic is thrown out to the floor for someone to pick, but again sharing is voluntary. All the chairperson does is control the discussion, keeping the topic on course, etc. None of the meetings I go to are small enough such that everyone gets the chance to speak. Just not enough time. So lighten up, Dude!

    And welcome, Barbara. Sorry to hear you have a bunch of asshole AA groups in your area. You seem to have made the best of it, though. We get some addicts in our AA meetings, and most newcomers are both alcoholics and addicts. We do emphasize that the discussion is limited
    to problems relating to alcohol, though. This isn't to cut the addicts out of the discussion so much as it is to put the lid on someone whining about being unable to quit Copenhagen etc.

    And those folks who smoke pot or do other drugs while they're in AA? They're not sober, and any group I know of that might be aware of this going on wouldn't consider them to be sober, thus don't even try to come up and get a chip or medallion.

    So stick around if you want. As Patrick said, we're always looking for ways to make things better. Your status doesn't offend anyone, believe me.

  5. Lighten up dude?

    Are you fucking high?

  6. Thought you'd like that one. Goes back to my fucking hippie days.

  7. Hey!!!!!I can dig it.
    Spent my first 2 years in NA with most of my friends being in AA (even though they were heroin addicts) because they felt safer in a AA meeting. Finally I had to speak with my NA sponsor and tell him if I heard another "drug a log" story I was going to kill myself, shit the whole life style of a drug addict was making me sick (keeping me sick). He asked me to meet him at his house after work the next day, I did. This is when I met Harry, 1/90. He became my AA sponsor and eventually one my best friends.
    Shit I wasted no time devouring the BB and practicing the steps. I wanted what you folks had at the time and was willing to work for it.
    NA helped a great deal (my foundation for the principles I use in my life today started in NA) but it was AA that gave me the opportunity to have balance in my life. Harry helped a great deal in this area. Counseling helped a great deal and many other experiences I have had since.
    I have never disrespected AA or its singleness of purpose. Because I never wanted to be responsible for the new comer who misunderstood why he was at a "Alcohol" Anonymous meeting.
    Thank you Barbara and best wishes to your recovery.
    Joe I do know people who go to AA meeting and still smoke pot, they pick up chips too.
    Why??? I really don't know nor care. I found out by mistake one day, I had known the guy for over a dozen years. I never would have suspected.
    I let it go. I know why I don't get high or drink.

  8. Oh I forgot, Barbara thanks a million for sharing. I had forgotten the early days that you described.
    Best wishes on your path.