The Disease Concept and Anti-AA problems

I wanted to talk about the 'disease' concept and the anti-AA. For some the 'disease' concept is an excuse not to use a 'spiritual' program. For others it's a sign that AA doesn't know what it's talking about.








The argument is that no doctor would tell you to pray and meditate if you had cancer.


I am your doctor, now do what I say!




Bill Wilson is alive and living in Argentina with Adolf Hitler


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Hello everyone. I’m really smart. I have a youtube channel called blamethenile. I make videos about alcoholics anonymous. Alcoholics Anonymous is a dangerous cult that makes people commit suicide. I know thousands of people who have committed suicide. They are all dead. I almost committed suicide because Alcoholics Anonymous destroyed my brain. Alcoholics Anonymous causes cancer and genital warts. I am obsessed by Alcoholics Anonymous. I dream about it. I don’t work. I sit around and obsess about Alcoholics Anonymous. I’m not an alcoholic. I like talking about depression, suicide, alcoholics anonymous and buckvanizm. The people in Alcoholics Anonymous are evil. There are millions of them. But I deny that. I like to deny things. I’m really smart. Alcoholics Anonymous has billions of dollars in secret vaults. They want to rule the world. Alcoholics Anonymous is responsible for the holocaust. Bill Wilson smoked cigarettes and cheated on his wife. I was arrested for not paying my child support so I decided to commit suicide. I blame Alcoholics Anonymous for causing my depression. I like to talk about myself. I like to blame other people. Alcoholics Anonymous has a 100% failure rate. Everybody is drunk. I’m losing my hair and my gums hurt. Alcoholics Anonymous caused this and I will make a video about it. Alcoholics Anonymous is an evil cult. My next video will be called Alcoholics Anonymous and child molestation. Stay tuned. One more thing; I’m really smart.

Pot Smoker bashing A.A.

Mar 16, 2009 -- 6:31PM, Wmdkitty wrote:

There's nothing TO "understand" about "alcoholics" -- you're not "sick" or "diseased", you simply CHOOSE to drink to excess.

Oct 8, 2009 -- 2:48AM, Mcgowdog wrote:

We aren't sick or diseased. I agree.
But... "Most alcoholics... for reasons yet obscure... have lost the power of choice in drink."

That's me. You must be one of the "few", huh kitty cat?

You're not even an alcoholic, are you?

If you are, you're what we real alcoholics call a "baby robin type alcoholic"... all mouth and no brains.


Mar 16, 2009 -- 7:42PM, cherubino wrote:

Good point, and assuming it's true, it follows logically that those who say "AA or the highway" are mistaken and quite possibly deluded. But even as such, they're still just private citizens who have opinions, like political party members and sports fans. They have no more civil or legal authority to enforce their views on the general public than does any other nut who holds forth from a soapbox.

AA is a private, civilian, voluntary organization doing busness in a free society under the protection of the First Amendment. It's not allied with any city, state, or federal law enforcement agency, nor with any correctional bureaucracy. Why not simply ignore them and walk away, just as you would from any other street corner crackpot or assembly thereof?

McGowdog:
Very nicely put. Some of you folks in here are pretty smart and pretty mature. It's too bad I came late. Doesn't look like much action in here anymore.

Mar 16, 2009 -- 8:34PM, Wmdkitty wrote:

And yet judges FORCE people into the program, and the program itself actively discourages members from associating with ANYONE who isn't in the program, discourages free thought (as evidenced by the 12-Step zombies who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves and others, and continue to prance about like AA is the BEST. THING. EVAR.) and it DAMAGES THE PARTICIPANTS by utterly destroying their minds, their self-esteem, and sense of self-worth. "You're an ADDICT. You're HOPELESS. You're nothing but a FAILURE. You NEED us, we're the ONLY ONES who understand, and we LOVE you!" It's the same thing abusers do to their victims.

McGowdog:
Waa! I almost forget we're talking about the poor poor victim alcoholic here. Why is the alcoholic in front of a judge? Because they chugged too many beers without swallowing? Because they dropped the beer bong? Or did they break the LAW? Judges don't force alcoholics to do anything. They give them an alternative; Bubba or A.A. meeting.

But once they get to A.A., the poor victim alky gets snuggies and swirlys? They're forced to pay a buck and buy a 7 dollar book and drink bad coffee.

Oh, the poor victims! A.A. is so rough!


Sep 8, 2009 -- 2:31PM, Wmdkitty wrote:

AA practices indoctrination, you are told that it is the only way, that "if you have one drink, you will die", and other such lies.

When, in truth, one drink won't kill you -- your lack of self-control, should you CHOOSE to have more than one, on the other hand, will.

When there are other recovery programs with better success rates, and no "spiritual program".
AA is a RELIGIOUSLY MOTIVATED program, a friggin' cult, and has a success rate of 5%, same as it is for people who quit on their own. In fact, I'd wager that people who quit on their own are better off, because they are not told to cut any (and all) ties to their "former" life, and have a real support system of family and friends to lean on.

What really burns me, though, is the blatant disregard for the First Amendment, shown when judges sentence a criminal to AA meetings -- the judge is saying, "attend this religious program, or go to jail." It's actually ILLEGAL to do that.

McGowdog:

A.A. practices no such doctrine. A.A. does not nor did it ever supply the desire to stop drinking to the prospect.

You can go drink if you want to. If you're not an alky or are one and don't want to stop drinking, don't go to A.A. and don't break the law.

It's just that simple. Why would you go to A.A. to drink booze? That's sort of like going to an abortion clinic to set up a lemans class, isn't it? That's just perverted.

Religious program, 5%, cult? Go back to Stinkin' Thinkin', you baby robin... all mouth and no brain 3 beer drinker.

M A from Stinkin Thinkin doggin me again

Quote of the Week: McGowdog
Posted on June 7, 2009 by M A
“The only reason why God is mentioned at all, is because without God, alcoholics perish. But, it’s not good to present that fact until the alcoholic sees the hopelessness of their condition in the 1st Step” – McGowdog (Stinkin’ Thinkin’ reader and AA zealot)“It all goes back to building our Program on a Truth or a lie.” – Also McGowdog, written less than twelve hours after the first quote.
Filed under: The Tool Shed Tagged: AA jackasses, AA lies, alcoholics anonymous, assholes, lies, mcgowdog, old-timers, Quotes, sober recovery, wingnuts
« The Crazies at Sober Recovery: Real Alcoholics, the Big Book and Selective Altruism
One Response
speedy0314, on June 7th, 2009 at 8:07 pm Said:
ma,
that’s classic.
i can just imagine a young m-puppy scribbling in a coloring book around dinner time & yelling, “mom, is it ‘truth’ yet?”


...

They can have their fun over there calling me an AA Jackass, an AA liar, an asshole, an old-timer??? not quite yet, a wingnut?

All I was saying there was that most alcoholics need Power outside of and beyond themselves to have removed the mental obsession that all alcoholics are said to have... remember that one? "The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking..."

But the A.A. Program isn't designed to just start off with "God will fix you." No. The distinction between the alcoholic and the nonalcoholic took about 55 pages to describe.

Then M.A., what's the next thing they go into in that dreaded Big Book? That's right! God. "We Agnostics". Understand? Didday?




“It all goes back to building our Program on a Truth or a lie.” – Also McGowdog

Yup. I said that too! What was the context?




""There seems to be people who just can't get their minds around the possibility that some in A.A. are not really alcoholics and that being in A.A. can make them worse.This is what I hear. I have a hard time fathoming this possibility/truth because that's not me... it's not my experience.It all goes back to building our Program on a Truth or a lie.

__________________So does God direct us, or suggest us?

Per SR guidelines... any quotes or paraphrases are from BB 1st Edition.""




So M.A. points out a couple of my posts and does nothing really, besides putting together some childish tags at the end.

You authors over at Stinkin Thinkin seem like a bunch of three beer drinkers. Do I have to tell you again what that is?

Buy one

Spill one,

Give one away.

You guys should go grow some nuts and call me back when you've got some pubes.

You guys are not real alcoholics and you're bent because you got run out of strong A.A. meetings. So being the potential addicts or potential hard-drinkers that you may be, you figure the alternate recovery programs like SMART, Life Ring, and Rational Recovery will work on real alcoholics too and A.A. will go down like your mothers and sisters on prom night? Sorry. Those programs may be great for the hard drinker, but here's what a world renowned doctor said about A.A.:

"What you say about the general hopelessness of the average alcoholic's plight is, in my opinion, correct...Had you offered yourselves as patients at this hospital, I would not have taken you, if I had been able to avoid it. People like you are too heartbreaking. Though not a religious person, I have profound respect for the spiritual approach in such cases as yours. For most cases, there is virtually no other solution."

"It goes back to building our program on a Truth and not on a lie."

Yup. That's right. If you're a hard drinker or a non-alcoholic, you cannot recover from alcoholism. Just as a non-cancer patient can't recover from cancer. But there's a lot of non-alkies in A.A. and I'd sure like to send them your way. They seem deserving of your fate.

For I have yet to meet the guy or gal in A.A. that admits they are just hard drinkers and are there for the bad coffee or the strange. So why do hard drinkers waste away in AA? Loneliness?

I asked my recovered alcoholic/recovered addict couselor buddy and spiritual guide from the local treatment center why he takes his clients to the strong open A.A. meeting and not to N.A., Smart, Life Ring, Rational Recovery, etc. and he said because they don't work for the real alcoholic and the real addict. So that leads me to believe you folks over at stinkin aren't even real addicts. Then I asked him if he'd ever heard of secular recoveries and he said all they do is sit around and bitch about A.A.! Just like you guys!