"One mom at a time"? That was a nice touch. I'm sure it went exactly like that. You had a member named Ben, with few teeth, he was a big book thumper, but he hurled all the slogans at you, drove a 10 speed. You say he had a really nice 10-speed? They make 21 speeds now... since for over 20 years. Are you saying his bike is as old as his teeth? Are you judging Ben's material accomplishments?
If you knew the antics of Ben so well, why did you take your mom there? Did you and your mom come up with the "Motherfuckers Anonymous" blast and discuss these sexual positions together? Did she help you carve out the "One mom at a time" plaque?
That's really sick shit you folks resort to. Let's see how many antiAAer claims you punched with that one vid, shall we?
- Ben was there with his "disciples"... his few teeth... and his 10 speed bicycle... in the fucking snow...
- Ben hurls MOTR Treatment Center slogans at you and you pull out that big old Brown Stamp collection...
- Betty... recovering crack whore with a nasty cough... but you sit right there next to her of course
- You somehow know she used dirty needles because don't all reformed crack whores brag about this?
- Oh, and she spits when she talks...
- And you have to hold hands with her because you are always stuck sitting next to her... during that Lord's Prayer...
- The Lord's Prayer is a "spiritual prayer", right?
- Ben determines what's spiritual and what's religious
- Momma's boy tells us how a Big Book Discussion meeting is just like a good ole Southern Baptist service!
- Betty knows the difference between God and Gawd! too.
- Betty told you to shut your mouth and listen... Sure she did! We believe ya!
- Ben threatened you with death and hurled a "Fake it till you make it blast!" Wow, the Quinella!
- Ben knows a lot about A.A. and he knows what you should and shouldn't do... a good sponsor has tons of advice.
- Momma's Boy is gonna go back to church, but not if Ben doesn't approve! After all, he's got that killer 10 Speed and few teeth!
- Momma's Boy asked Ben for permission to quit smoking... told to go try to quit jerking off instead
- Ole Betty has good advice too... meetings, meditation, and masterbation... sound advice from a Crack Whore who spits...
- Got them meds, because isn't every AAer dually diagnosed? Got them meds and need to have old Ben tell me to stop using them... he drives that killer 10 speed and only has 3 teeth... in the snow... he's gotta be my favorite mentor...
- Tried to kill yourself, Ben told you that you were selfish... and somehow wound up doing a Youtube vid! Wow! God is great, huh?
- Them alkies in A.A. are sure powerless... and also liars, cheats and thiefs...
- So there's momma's boy... with his mom... next to the spitting ex-Crack Whore... with Ben shouting slogans to you... and now you've got motherfucker talking about how he'd like to do his mom.
- Unusual meeting... but you brought mom along...
- Mom was shocked...
- Momma's boy was gonna be the hero and steer the meeting back to the proper topic... experiences related to alcohol... but old Ben told you to not take other people's inventories...
- Then Ben follows that up with a "Your best thinking got you here" blast
- Old Ben told you to sit down, shut up, and listen... and because you've known him for all of two weeks, you take his advice.
- Nice opportunity to pimp the "Small Book" and Agent Orange at http://www.orange-papers.org/, because... this guy has a lot of hope for drunks, right?
- Something clicked, then Momma's Boy realized that A.A. is a religious cult... or a religion when the courts make a judgement on it... but back to a cult when dealing with vulnerable drunks... because who doesn't like to fuck with vulnerable drunks?
- Old momma's boy... even though he only knew toothless 10-speed riding in the snow Ben for 14 meetings, ... has been to thousands of A.A. meetings... so Momma's Boy has 5 and a half years of meetings under his belt... but has not yet lost the desire to stop drinking, had been called a "chronic relapser"... was told that he didn't work the steps properly... from what appears to be a real step working group! Wow! Surprise.
- Momma's boy left the meeting, and everything fell into place for him! But he just had to go back and tell old Ben about his new success... of staying sober by staying away from A.A.
- Old Ben got pissed.
- Momma's Boy felt the need to take just a little more of toothless, 10-speed driving Ben's advice...
- Old momma's boy has been sober ever since he left A.A., but he's still thinking about how cold his saved seat must be by now...
Momma's Boy's 3 questions for you;
- Is A.A. really working for you?
- How well do you really know these people?
- Are A.A. meetings really a safe place for me/us to be?
Now... A.A., a dangerous religious cult, posses itself as the "only" answer for your drinking problem.
So, do XAers/antiAAers mean us harm? Of course not! They're good people. They are truthful. They bring up good fair discussions and shed light on some of our problems and weaknesses without embellishment and exaggeration. They're fresh and never ever repeat themselves. They never exploit or take advantage of the plight of incest victims, people with chronic mental illnesses, manic depressives, schizophrenics like my brother who aren't alcoholics and don't go to A.A. meetings anyway, etc.
I'm starting to think that sobriety is like a rubber band. Poor innocent and motivated suffering wet alcoholics are just somehow stuck, get sent to A.A., since it's the only solution and they're forced to A.A. from the sock-puppet American Judicial system, and once they get to A.A., they suffer horid religious indoctrination, 13th stepping, mental anguish and punishment... but when they leave A.A., they go on to live healthy normal, useful, well-balanced, lucrative, sober, coffee-free, tobacco-free, sugar-free, fart-free, 10 speed-free, spit-free lives, and can go back onto their anti-depressant, manic-depressive, paranoid scizophrenic pills! But they don't cheat on their wives and they don't drink fucking coffee or smoke fucking cigarettes or say that Goddamned Lord's Prayer!
Sign me up!
ExposeAA, and his ilk... like to talk about how A.A.ers get off on the suffering of those who don't do the program as described, those who leave A.A., and especially XAers/antiAAers encountered on the web.
I say that's not true and just not even logical. We started off as wet drunks ourselves, remember? Now we're to feel guilty about achieving sobriety with the method presented to us?
- A.A. is working well for me. It really is. I put a lot less into it timewise as many do. I do 1 or 2 meetings a week unless I have time and a reason to go to another one. I spend time with other A.A.s for leisure, program, church, spiritual retreats, weddings, funerals, for lunch/dinner, household projects/moving, etc.
- How well do I know these people? Some I've known since 1994. That's before some of you little crumb snatchers have been pissing your pants.
- Are A.A. meetings a safe place to be? Just what kind of protection do real alcoholics need? Are you vulnerable in meetings because you're young, female, experiencing other problems than alcoholism? IDK. There are usually many different kinds of meetings in a decent sized town. Do you want to go to a meeting in broad daylight at a well-attended meeting in some very public strip-mall somewhere? Somewhere that's not out in the boondocks in some church basement? Find what is comfortable. Bring your APBT and your mace. IDK. Never been an issue for me. I heard a guy in a forum discribe a meeting this way;
"There is one group where I live that is like a bar without the alcohol. They fight, yell, and basically use the room for everything but recovery. Its known as the shoebox. Filled with slippers, loafers, and sneakers. Some are sicker than others, and that becomes very apparent in some groups. "
So what I want to know is this; us pertetrator proAAers are to feel guilty about how we treat our poor abused suffering antiAAer/XAer counterparts... when we just know where they stand? Or where they sit, actually... on their asses on their comfy couches in their air-conditioned homes behind their nice cozy computers.
So much suffering going on here, it just breaks my fucking heart.
So... we've been called out on our accountability by some avid anti/XAer. FTG to be exact. I saw her post in the mentalhelp site. She's ranting about her wonderful article about how AAers are only concerned with their own asses. That makes sense, right? Harm others and God will keep ya sober.
Here's her post and my hopefully allowed response to it. You get the inside scoop here. BTW, I left a response to exposeAA on that disturbing vid today. I have to be honest. It really did rattle me. It had me wondering for a sec... "What if A.A. really is a cult? How blind am I? Should I run from it now and not look back? Are we that harmful? Is there no God? Is there a God, but He hates me and the likes of A.A.?
So I confronted the vid with an open mind and... he's just fucking with us! Look at all the contradictions in that one vid? But... I manned up and asked him to answer me straght out; is it true or is it false? We'll see. If it's true, that meeting/group/individual needs to be dealt with.
please advise - FTG - Jun 6th 2010
I shouldn’t have to pay taxes for schools. My kids are grown.Why should I call the cops? I don’t even know those people.Health Care Reform? I’m healthy and I don’t want to pay for anyone else’s problems!I don’t know why you say such hateful things about Father Bollier. He never touched me.Well, so what if he was getting bullied or whatever? He didn’t have to be there.Of course she got raped. Did you see what she was wearing?You should have seen this woman slapping her kid around in the store today! No, of course I didn’t. It’s none of my business.Climate change? Whatever. I don’t see anything. (Besides, I’ll be dead by the time California floats away.)We really shouldn’t publicize how many children have been killed or have died because of the Iraq war, because it will just erode our morale.I won’t speak to whether or not people get abused in AA. All I know is that it saved my life.Dear AA Members,What profound level of spiritual awakenedness allows you to respond to trenchant criticism of AA – and to the alarming evidence of its lack of accountability and oversight – by saying that the only thing that really matters is that it worked for you?
I’m only asking, because I’ve heard variations on this response so many times. It seems to be the last word
— the AA Trump Card.
I’ve been mulling this over for a couple of days, but just had to ask, finally, after reading this AAs comment on gratitude;
I live a fantastic life today………… If AA & 12steps can be construed as religious or you have a personal dislike of it…..
then I am sorry AA was or is a bad experience for you……….
Regardless of how others percieve AA…… all I know is it saves my ass and many of my dear fellowship friends……
Well, AAs, thanks in advance for your detailed responses,
Now, my response; (Have to put it here because ... I can't respond to ftg due to censorship)
No ftg - McGowdog - June 7th, 2010
No FTG. What you and some of your minions have cooked up to be the "Soup du Jour" in XA and antiAA, the idea was stolen from someone else earlier in the week and regurgitated and pimped by you, as has been your XA/antiAA stomping ground.
We know where your website is. It's like Australia and old mens' underwear. You have gr8 support amongst your minions and you have a gr8 following. But we see what happens to those who are proAA. They are cast out as vicious, cultlike, zealots. At least here, both sides have a voice.
Now, I'd like to direct some of you to... not my website, I'm proAA and I'm nasty. Not a popular combination... but at least I show accountability... but I'd like to direct you to a youtube vid that some of you anti/XAers love;
In this vid, a newcomer claims to take their own mom to a meeting and horrible things happen in this meeting. I say it's a lie and it's beyond embellished. It belittles people who are victims to incest and there are 32 other claims that do nothing but contradict each other. It's a bunch of lies. But some of you get a kick out of it.
A.A. is still one beggar trying to show another where there's bread. Our respect to your alternatives will become apparent just the moment we learn to brush aside the bs.
P.S. I'm sober today and I've not harmed anybody today. Can you say the same?
Yes. It does say it all. It says you're a little ankle biter chihuahua dog without the balls to put your username down.
Where's your accountability and whom have you helped today? All the poor people who you've saved from A.A.? Your pitch is stale. Your goose is cooked. The jig is up.
What do you have to offer alcoholics besides A.A.? Pointing fingers at proAAers? Does that keep a drunk from taking the next drink? Honestly?
If you can stay sober on mind control, do it.
If you can stay sober on "Love thy Neighbor", do it.
Let me use your own claims against you; If a method works for a person to get and stay sober, how could it be wrong?
That somebody in A.A. would harm another person on this planet and have that work for them is just plain and absolute bullshit.
Go peddle your wares someplace else anti/XAer scumbags.